Difference between revisions of "Talk:Animal Kung-Foolery"

Latest revision as of 07:11, 19 March 2013

Some hit messages: You perform a flying duck elbow, and do 123 damage. You perform a squirrel nibble followed by a chipmunk crunch, and do 115 damage. You perform a tortoise twister, and do 118 damage. You perform a snarling frog wallop, and do 110 damage. You perform an aardvark scissor kick, and do 120 damage.

-- Some etremely limited "testing" (nothing reliable) suggest that this is autohit, damage may be something like base weapon damage + 10*SP, didn't seem to go up with level/strength (as much as normal attack did). --XKiv 10:41, 25 February 2012 (PST)

Someone should probably spade this. I think Cris confirmed that it is autohit, but everything else is wrong. --hoyifung04 07:27, 12 November 2012 (PST)

From my uses I can tell it always hits like a spell, is based on the Strength stat alone and the power of the weapons has a contribution proportional to its power, however I dunno how skill points affect it. Patojonas 08:46, 12 November 2012 (PST)

I don't think weapon power has anything to do with the damage, actually. A bat (5 power) and the umr staff (666 power) do the same damage for kung-foolery. --Satan Hammer Time, 10 March 2013 (CDT)

After weeks of work on these, this is what I got: link to spreadsheet.
These values were obtained with 2 level 57 alts, in the The Farthest Reaches of Insanity, since all foes scale. Damages to crawling mist weren't considered due to its weaknesses.
Values from both alts with same STR and offence power are equal and fit well on the graphics, proving only STR and offence values matter.
Adding 10 levels to one of the alts didn't change the ranges significantly (1-2 point difference can be accounted to math roundings and/or possible effects of the foe's scaling mechanic).
Some of the regressions were better fitter by polynomial functions instead of a linear fit, however both options had and R squared above 0.99 so the simplest fit was picked.
Please note that the formula I reached might be off in non scaling foes weaker than you, mainly because foe defence is accounted and there's no way for me to figure that out.

In the end, I arrived to the following formula: Round { 8.5 + (SP*0.05 + 0.2 + 0.017)*STR + (0.3 ± 0.1)*Offence ±(-4.5) }

There's an option to download the file if you're having trouble seeing the graphics, let me know if you think I made a mistake somewhere.

Edit: Added the missing term and fixed the math, now it works properly. Patojonas 08:32, 17 March 2013 (PDT)

Holy Hell that's a lot of work. Cristiona (talk) 20:30, 16 March 2013 (PDT)

I'm still not certain offense has even that big of a hand in the damage distribution. Between the bat and the staff, there should've been some noticeable difference with .2-.4 range, but I got nothing. The skill also does the same damage to each level of mechapinata, so unless they all had the same defense, it completely ignores foe defense. - Satan End of Time, 17 March 2013 (CDT)

Did you miss the part where I only change the offence power and, consistently, different values show up? I believe it's pretty clear it plays a relevant role.
Regarding pinatas, I do believe they all have the same defence, yeah.
Anyway, its easy to check, go kill a foe in insanity and in the canonball tavern, one has values adjusted to you, the other to level 1. Patojonas 16:19, 17 March 2013 (PDT)

Pinatas have levels and damage caps. While all pinatas in a given rank have the same stats (eg: all scouts are the same) they differ across ranks. Checking my "notes" on the skill, weapon power is supposed to be a factor with the damage. The problem is it's pretty hinky, and +% damage boosts aren't factored in. I believe they're applied after the skill finishes figuring everything out, so testing with, say, a Torch is going to screw things up.Cristiona (talk) 21:09, 17 March 2013 (PDT)

Weapon damage boosts apply even though its a skill? I at least know for sure that the damage bonus from Thewsday doesn't apply to this. Patojonas 10:13, 18 March 2013 (PDT)

Well, maybe. It's a little vague, and it's a 18 month old conversation, so some context is missing. Re-reading, it looks like damage boosters are indeed left out, which is why it has a hard time competing with the Torch and Maul as the +50% is just insane. Cristiona (talk) 20:00, 18 March 2013 (PDT)

Well, full maul does *5 on damage, so it would give at least 1 (or 1.25?) point of damage per point of strength, compared to full kung-foolery's 0.717 damage per strength, so maul is better as long as it hits at least 72% of the time (not accounting for criticals and lower PP cost, even) --XKiv (talk) 08:11, 19 March 2013 (PDT)

Yes, different ranks of pinatas all take the same amount of damage. I was unaware of damage 'caps'. How do these work? I was doing around 700 damage to all ranks of pinatas, switching between the sceptre (666 power) and bat (5 power). Doubling STR added around 350 damage, so it's not like there's a hard damage cap. Is it a soft damage cap, where only a certain amount of damage goes through, and then the rest gets dampened? You'd still expect some sort of variation in the damage, it makes zero difference whether you're using the bat or the sceptre. The pinatas are the only thing I've been paying attention to when using the skill, so it's possible there's just some weirdness going on with their damage mechanics that's causing the skill not to behave like it normally would. -- Satan (For This) Ain't Nobody Got Time, 18 March 2013 (CDT)

Sounds like something that needs to be spaded. Cristiona (talk) 20:00, 18 March 2013 (PDT)